115. Money Myths to Ditch

In this episode of the Women in Money Cafe, the hosts discuss their old beliefs about money and reveal how they've evolved their views. From thinking they were useless with money or that they didn't deserve it, to believing that wealth equates happiness, each shares their journey to understanding their relationship with money. They touch on the impact of upbringing, work pressures, societal influences such as social media on perceptions about money and address money-related guilt. They also reflect on how financial coaching has illuminated their misconceptions and helped them reshape their thoughts around money, emphasising that everyone's belief about money is unique to their personal experiences and circumstances.

00:00 Introduction and Welcome
00:11 Exploring Old Beliefs About Money
00:52 Introducing the Co-Hosts
01:33 Sara's Money Beliefs Transformation
09:31 Emily's Perception of Money and Happiness
16:48 Michelle's Journey to Self-Worth and Money
28:04 Julie's Realization About Money and Importance
33:26 Final Thoughts and Wrap Up

YOUR HOST

Julie Flynn is an experienced independent financial adviser and financial coach. Justice and equality drive Julie. Which is why she’s spent years studying and researching how stress affects our financial decision making.

Julie is best known for her work with women who have lost their partner and coaching financial services business who want to implement fair and transparent charges.
Ebb & Flow Financial Coaching | Bree Wealth & Tax | Instagram


CO-HOSTS
Emily Pool is a Financial Planner and Will Writer. She is passionate about empowering people to invest their wealth (pensions and savings) sustainably and in line with their personal values.


Michelle Lambell  started her career in financial services as a Stockbroker in 1999 undertaking both advisory and discretionary investment management. Today she is a Chartered Financial Planner, specialising in retirement planning advice, pensions and investments and a Certified Financial Coach. 

Sara Walker is a financial planner and financial coach with 33 years’ experience in financial services. She wants all women to feel financially confident and uses her professional and life experiences to support and educate women over 40 so they in turn feel able to support and be role models for the younger women in their lives.

Jennifer O'Neil is a mortgage and protection specialist and director of Athena Mortgages. Having been in the industry since 2014 Jennifer decided to set up a company in 2020 that suited her core values as a broker – integrity, service, honesty and continuous improvement.
LinkedIn | Instagram | Facebook

Transcript

Julie [00:00:08]:

Welcome back to this episode of the Women and Money Cafe.

Julie [00:00:25]:

Now today Right? Because you know how we like to look at the emotional side of money as well as the practical side of Money. We thought we would have a little delve into to the old beliefs that we had about money. Because as you know, we're all financial coaches as well, and Emily really into our financial well-being. And so we've done a lot of we we've become really aware that we have these beliefs about money. Everybody does. It's not just us. And the really scary thing is loads of them are rubbish. A lot of the beliefs that we Emily around about money are rubbish.

Julie [00:01:00]:

So we thought, Let's go and have a little delve in our memory banks to think about what did we used to believe about money that we no longer believe. So we're going to bear all In this episode of the Women and Money Cafe. Now my willing victims sorry. My co-host today are Sara.

Sara [00:01:19]:

Hi, Julie.

Julie [00:01:20]:

Hi, Sara. I've got Michelle.

Michelle [00:01:24]:

Hi, Julie.

Julie [00:01:25]:

Wake up at the back there, Michelle. And I've got Emily.

Sara [00:01:29]:

Howdy. Alright.

Julie [00:01:31]:

Okay. I've got crow boy Emily with me today, and I can tell you it's a thrill. Oh, dear. Alright. No. So let's say we just got thinking, right, what would be a really good thing to share? And I think as we all do have these white weird and wacky ideas about money in our head, and until we shine a light on them, we think they're really normal. So we thought we would delve into them today. Now I've got a really nice juicy one to get us started.

Julie [00:01:57]:

So I'm going to it's over to you, Sara. Tell me something That you used to believe about money that you now no longer believe.

Sara [00:02:07]:

Well, I used to believe I was useless with money. Oh. Wow.

Julie [00:02:16]:

Tell us more.

Sara [00:02:16]:

I don't think I'm useless Women money. Understand myself, and how to how to manage Money. There's a difference. Tell you more.

Julie [00:02:28]:

Expand on that. Otherwise, it's going to be a really short episode.

Sara [00:02:31]:

Okay. Basically, you know when you get pocket money when you're a kid?

Michelle [00:02:38]:

I

Sara [00:02:38]:

say, my brother is 7 years younger than me, and we always got given pocket money. We're very fortunate. We always have pocket Money, and We were allowed to spend so much of it in the local sweet shop. So you'd go down to the local sweet shop. This will tell you so much about me that's really quite scary. You go down to local sweet shop. And if you spend, I don't know, say a pound on sweets, we'd both spend pound on sweets. We'd come back.

Sara [00:03:06]:

Within 2 days, mine would have all been gone. My brothers will last him until he's next allowed. By the way, he is a chartered financial planner now, so Certified financial rather, so until the end of it. So that because I used to do that, which is more about the Chocolate, it was about the money. That's what started people telling me you're not very good with money Because your pocket money is all spent. And, of course, I was that much older, so we're going to have to going to have to go back and imagine things here for younger listeners, but they used to be able to get This thing called vinyl records, and we just go down the local shop and get, you know, the single that was out and all that sort of stuff. So I've had things I wanted to spend my money on. That said, I did start working in a in a as a Sure.

Sara [00:03:56]:

But I was 14, which, again, you could back in those days. And, yeah, I used to think it was great. I've got my own money. This isn't pocket money that somebody's saying you should, or you shouldn't. This is my own money, so I can do what I bloody would like. And I did. I used to when I look back now, I think why do people think I was used to this money? Because I bought my own clothes with it. I did this with it.

Sara [00:04:21]:

I did that with it. I paid my own way, and I was actually learning from a very young age to be financially independent, which actually is really, really important. But because nobody taught me how to save or the importance of saving or thinking of the future, I was just Jennifer thing we've already discussed in other episodes. I'm quite spontaneous. And it's just always been there, but that doesn't mean you're useless with money. But if your people will tell you that you're, you know, you're not very good at this, are you? You're not very good at saving. You're not very good at this. You should be doing this.

Sara [00:04:56]:

You run out of money and things like that, then you start to believe it, and you just get set in that pattern of behaviour because this is who I am. This is how I do it. So it started from quite a young age, basically.

Julie [00:05:09]:

And so having got this message at a young age Women, really, they've misidentified the problem. You have a problem with chocolate, don't you? It's not a problem with money. You have a problem Chocolate, which I think many of us can relate to. But who do you think that influenced You then, as you were growing up, having taken on board this message, what were the repercussions, do you think?

Sara [00:05:35]:

I think the biggest repercussion was that because I didn't like what they were saying to me and I didn't really understand why, I stopped listening. So then even when they were saying something helpful or useful or good, I still wasn't listening. They're saying, hey. I'm going off over here and doing the opposite. So, that was the biggest problem.

Julie [00:05:58]:

Were there any benefits, do you think?

Sara [00:06:02]:

What's been told here? You're not very good with money.

Julie [00:06:05]:

For carrying the belief that I'm not very good with money, were there any upsides to it?

Sara [00:06:10]:

Not really. No. I don't think so. I mean, I no. Because I just thought I suppose I suppose when there were times in my life, particularly on my end, if I was if I was felt I was, you know, managing things and doing quite well, and I looked, I still didn't believe that I was doing a very good job Right. Because I'd known perhaps others that were doing better. I would never look consider people of my peers or friends who are in who are doing a worse job or a struggle. It was always the ones who were doing better.

Sara [00:06:44]:

Yeah. So, no, it didn't it didn't help, because even if I was doing quite well, I didn't think I was doing quite well because I could should be doing better.

Michelle [00:06:54]:

Right. Everybody.

Julie [00:06:56]:

So how did you come to the realization that possibly this belief was not true?

Sara [00:07:04]:

Do you know what? It wasn't until I started doing financial coaching training.

Julie [00:07:09]:

Right. And so how did that play out for you?

Sara [00:07:15]:

Well, it was quite it's quite a blood loving moment, Emily. Because as you all know, because you've all done it, when you're doing all those practice things and people are asking a question and it all starts to come out, you suddenly think, oh, it really does go back to then. And then you start to actually share some of the things that you have done and what you have gone through, and you think, actually, I've been pretty good. And what is good and what is bad?

Michelle [00:07:41]:

is

Sara [00:07:41]:

relevant, really. It's only what matters for you and yours and what works for you and your and The rest there is no good and bad. It's just it's just what matters for you. So, yeah, it wasn't really until office, I Money aware, but that real when you really took it right the way back, I thought flipping it back. I'm straight away from there. And then, yeah, I felt I could look back over the challenging times or things that happened that were good or bad and think, actually, how well I'd coped or even when I'd got, You know, we have really challenges or whatever, and then you get over them and how you then apply things and do things and survived and all the rest of it. I just think, actually, Everybody goes through times when they don't do so well at anything. But if you can then I felt able to go back as, actually, I did really well Then or through that or with that, and I felt I could say nice things about it and start believing in in those nice things instead of just being, well, that's because I wasn't very good with money.

Julie [00:08:47]:

Alright. So I'm going to guess there's quite a few people listening to this. They may also have The dialogue in their head. I'm not very good with money. That's why they're listening. So I wondered if you had Any advice or any words of wisdom for anybody else that's carrying this belief?

Sara [00:09:07]:

Well, I mean, I think when you try and think back to your early memories of money and those early conversations that you either heard or were part of, and then how people talk to you about money. And then just think about the things that have happened to you in your life and just look back and think, yeah, there will be times when you think, god, I really messed that up or I didn't handle that very well. But try and think about the ones where you did because there really will be times even if it's times when perhaps all you did was survive, but you managed to survive. Think about those good times and really praise yourself for what you did. And instead of saying, I'm not very good with money, You can you know, it's changing it's changing the language and just saying, I didn't understand money.

Julie [00:09:56]:

Yeah.

Sara [00:09:58]:

You know, we didn't you don't we don't born into this world, I mean, knowing what it all means. I didn't understand money. I didn't understand me.

Julie [00:10:07]:

Yeah.

Sara [00:10:08]:

You know? And it and it's accepting that that it's that really is okay.

Julie [00:10:13]:

Yep. I love that. Absolutely love that. Thank you. Thanks for sharing share Sara. Okay. So, Emily, How do you feel about sharing something that you used to believe about money that you no longer believe?

Emily [00:10:33]:

I think that a lot of younger people, particularly nowadays, who are totally brainwashed by Instagram and TikTok and influencers who are basically putting ideas into their head that if you have an amazing lifestyle of Driving an amazing car, wearing all the latest fashion trends, you know, just having this ultra abundant, luxurious lifestyle. Style. I think that these people who are watching these things, if they're young and impressionable, are believing that Money and all the trappings that come with money and wealth can bring you happiness.

Julie [00:11:20]:

And is that something that resonates with the younger part of you?

Emily [00:11:24]:

Yeah. Definitely. Right. I think when we're young and naive I mean, I used to remember lying in bed at night, struggling to get to sleep and just thinking about how wealthy I was going to be and what kind of clothes I was going to wear and, not what car I was going to drive because that's never been something that's interested me, but maybe what kind of house I was going to live in. No. I just had these dreams. you don't dream you can have a 2 up, 2 down, nice car to drive, you know, ability to put nice food on the table. Do you don't dream for enough.

Julie [00:12:02]:

Were you dreaming big, Emily?

Emily [00:12:04]:

Yeah. I think I think just everyone, Was it just me?

Julie [00:12:07]:

Nothing wrong with dreaming big?

Emily [00:12:09]:

There's nothing wrong with dreaming big at all. As long as you understand that dreaming big does not equal happiness because true happiness is something that comes from within and can never be satisfied by external Thanks, is very much my Julie, and I'm very keen to talk to my clients about financial well-being because The ones that come to me and have a goal in their head, which is a figure, you know, If they come to me and they say, oh, yeah. I want to have a 1,000,000 pound in my pension pot, that that is just crazy to me. Having a £1,000,000 in your pension pot is literally a number on a pension statement. What does that mean to your life? There's so many other things that are more important than that number on that bit of paper, you know, and that's your health, your friends, Your family, all the things that really, really make you happy. And having that £1,000,000 in your pot is not going to guarantee that.

Julie [00:13:20]:

So I'm going to come in with one of my curiosity questions now. Okay? So we've got younger Emily who can't get to sleep at night, And she's lying in bed, and she's dreaming of big houses and nice clothes. Probably trips to Brazil is what I suspect, and

Emily [00:13:34]:

the old spa weekend. Yeah.

Julie [00:13:36]:

Like, you know, younger version of you is thinking this is what this is what's going to give your life meaning. This is what's going to make you happy. And, obviously, like, Emily today in 2024 Think slightly differently to the Emily that couldn't get to sleep. So I'm wondering, when did it start to dawn on you the, you know, the acquisition of Expensive things and possessions is not necessarily the key to happiness. When do you think that penny started to drop?

Emily [00:14:04]:

Oh, gosh. This might sound a bit weird now. But

Julie [00:14:07]:

The weirder, the better. Let's have it.

Emily [00:14:13]:

Well, I think that the trouble is, for most people, in order to Be that wealthy unless Women miracle happens and you get just you win the lottery or something like that. In order to be That level of wealthy, you have to sacrifice an awful lot because most people have to work reasonably hard. And then I know there's this different idea now that, actually, you don't need to work hard. You just need to learn work smart. And whilst I agree with that to some extent, I think you have to be a little bit careful because I think that message is also being sold to the young younger Instagram generation that you don't have to work hard and you can still be a millionaire. And I'm not saying that's not possible for the small few. But For most of us, I still think we have to work reasonably hard or at least learn the best places to put our energy in order to get that wealth. And so what I'm saying is that sometimes the process of getting to that level of wealth is not going to make you happy.

Julie [00:15:23]:

Right.

Emily [00:15:24]:

Sometimes the, the pressure that you put on yourself to get there is too much and sometimes a slower, more patient approach to getting to wealth. But wealth in the sense that it's not wealth for wealth's sake, but wealth being a combination of happiness, health and having enough.

Julie [00:15:50]:

Alright. Was there something was there a point in your life when this message started to get through to you? In mind, the rest of us didn't figure anything out until we were, like, mid to late forties, early fifties. Still be embarrassed if it was later. Right? No. I think Cafe out with something in your twenties, I'm going to believe you.

Emily [00:16:09]:

No. I think towards my late twenties, early thirties because working in the city was tough. It was hard. It was, you know, you were sacrificing your health probably a lot of the time because you were So stressed and working all hours. Not saying there weren't fun times, but you were almost too busy to just stop and consider, am I happy? Am I healthy? Am I do am I in the right place? Am I living in line with my values? All of those things, it's until you reach that steady state of, yes, I'm living in line with my values, and I'm comfortable, and I'm you know, I've got Headspace. I'm not completely stressed out. That it's all that internal stuff that makes you truly happy. It's not All of the external stuff that you say, oh, what if I go on that holiday, if I have that bag, if I go on that spa weekend.

Emily [00:17:07]:

I mean, these things are nice if you're spending time with people that you love. But, you know, it's not the be or and end all. It's just It's something deeper that sound really weird. Obviously, if you're no. I think it probably doesn't sound weird to those who have reached that point. And for those who haven't reached that point, I hope that you can reach that point because I think it's important.

Julie [00:17:36]:

Alright. Okay. Look. Thank you very much. Uh-huh. Thank you for sharing that with us. So it sounds like yours was a bit more of a gradual process. Whereas, Sara, I think you had a bit of a road to Damascus moment, didn't you?

Michelle [00:17:48]:

Yes.

Julie [00:17:50]:

Was that was that a fair summary?

Sara [00:17:52]:

Yeah. I think so.

Julie [00:17:53]:

It's alright. I'm a road to Damascus person as well. Michelle, what about yourself?

Michelle [00:18:02]:

I think for me, the belief was always that I didn't deserve money. I would never have money. I would never earn over a certain amount. I would never be one of those people that you sort of saw I always let you know, you look at other people and you think, I'm never going to have a life like that. I'm not going to you know, I don't deserve to have that kind of Money. And I can't even tell you what made me Believe that. I know there were certain people in my life, certain toxic people that told me I would never amount to anything and I would never Have these things. And I go, no.

Michelle [00:18:37]:

I don't believe you. But probably deep down, I did because it has an effect on you, and it makes you feel that way. And even now, I still struggle with it. So it's probably I'm definitely not twenties, thirties. I'm definitely forties going, okay. Maybe I can earn This much money. Maybe I can have a house. I mean, I had the conversation with a colleague who's you know, we are looking to buy a house some point and I'm saying a price of house, and they're saying, well, why don't you have that price of house? And I'm going, well, I couldn't have a house like that.

Michelle [00:19:06]:

People like me don't have a house like that. And he's saying, well, why not? And I because that's not going to happen. So, yeah, I think that's I I've changed to an extent where I can accept, You know, potentially earning more than I ever have. However, it's still a it's still a learning curve. I still have still struggle with it a lot.

Julie [00:19:29]:

Right. So what was it like for you then when you first started to realize that this is a story that you've been telling yourself about what you could and couldn't have in life. And I was just curious about when the penny starts to drop, Poole think, hang on. This is just a story. It's not a fact.

Michelle [00:19:50]:

I think I felt really uncomfortable because I was like, well, actually, I'm coming out of my comfort zone of what I thought my life would be. You know, all those years of believing something and people telling you certain things. And, actually, that's really uncomfortable because then you're becoming something you never thought you would be. It's not a bad thing, but it's not Me as such. And, yeah, you may have some people who then look at you and go, well, you've changed because you do this and you, you know, you do that. And She want to because that's my life. I've worked hard to do what I want to do. So it's about gaining the confidence, but it's very uncomfortable Start with, and then you need the confidence to be able to go, no.

Michelle [00:20:30]:

That's okay.

Julie [00:20:32]:

Yeah. That's interesting because if you spent 40 years telling yourself one thing, And now you're, like, trying to tell yourself something else, and it's tied in with your identity then, isn't it? Because one of the things you said is I am not someone who can have these things? Who can do that? So it's I am. So it is. It's really tied in your identity. So I'm not surprised it was uncomfortable. What kind of small things did you did you start to do to get yourself used to this new idea that you are deserving of money?

Michelle [00:21:06]:

No. I don't think dreaming of what I could have because I've never been someone He's dreamt a lot about what I may or may not have, but doing small things. So, like, having a holiday that I didn't think I'd ever have. You know, so the last 2, 3 years, aside from COVID, we've had family holidays that I would never have had. You know, never thought I could have with my children and with my husband. And there is a guilt thing that goes with it because you go, oh my god. I just Spent that much money on a holiday. And then I think, well, I've just made amazing memories with my, you know, with my family.

Michelle [00:21:40]:

But you still have you still have that argument in my head, And that's where I'm now coming to with considering a house. Right. Will people judge me by a certain kind of house? But, actually, why can't I have that kind of house? But, yeah, it it's a real battle in my head.

Julie [00:22:00]:

Right. So it sounds like it's an ongoing process for you as well, especially with Yes.

Michelle [00:22:06]:

I'm definitely not. I'm definitely at the beginning of that. Yeah.

Emily [00:22:09]:

It's terrible, isn't it, why we always feel like we have to justify these things to ourselves? Yeah. And it and it's what we learn as children. Somebody told us That that wasn't for you.

Julie [00:22:23]:

So since you've started to acclimatize yourself to the idea that you are deserving of money. Apart from the holidays and considering possibly a bigger house, are there any other ways that that's kind of influenced how life has changed for you.

Michelle [00:22:42]:

I feel a bit freer in that. Actually, when I have money, I can do things with it, and I'm not feeling guilty. You know? I think, actually, I can have those things. There's nothing to stop me. I do find myself so my husband will sometimes say, well, peep you know, people like us don't do that. And I would actually turn around now and go, why? Because we're not a type of person. We can do what we want to do. So I'm challenging him, but internally, I'm happy to have you.

Michelle [00:23:14]:

Okay. Yeah. But about I suppose that's the planner and the coach in me will say to him, well, why not? Why can't we have that? Because that's what I'm used to doing with clients. But internally, yeah, I'm having that big wobble moment going, oh

Julie [00:23:28]:

my god. Can I? Can I?

Emily [00:23:30]:

I do just hate that term, PLU, don't you? Do you I mean, the whole PLU, people like us, It's BS, isn't it, talking in that conundrum? We are our own individual selves. We get to choose our we only get Money life, Can't we choose it ourselves?

Julie [00:23:51]:

So, Michelle. Right? I want you to imagine I'm a client. Okay. And I want to buy a house. Let's say I have come to you. I'm going to have to think of big numbers here because you live on the South Coast. So this is going to blow my mind, folks. I've come to you, and I've said to you that I've got a budget of £400,000 to buy a house.

Julie [00:24:15]:

And you're looking at me. You're looking at my circumstances, and you're like, jeez, Julie, you can afford a ¾ million pound house. What are you going to say to me to shift me from the 400 grand, which I'm having a cardiac by the way, folks, So mindset house to moving me to the 3 quarters of a £1,000,000. See, I couldn't go to a £1,000,000. That was too far for me. What would you say to me as a client?

Michelle [00:24:43]:

I think I would ask why a 400,000 pound house. Is there a particular reason? Do you want to do it up? Do you want to, you know, do some major work? Or, you know, what what's the reason behind That price range. Well, it

Julie [00:24:58]:

just It just seems like a sensible amount to spend on a house.

Michelle [00:25:03]:

But would you not like something different?

Julie [00:25:10]:

Yes. For the benefit of the listeners, my head just exploded.

Michelle [00:25:15]:

Why

Julie [00:25:16]:

is it put

Michelle [00:25:16]:

us on? Exactly what my colleague did to me.

Emily [00:25:20]:

But isn't it exactly the same as the client that comes to me and says he wants a £1,000,000 in his pension pot? Why does the number matter? She says it's a financial planner. But the thing is, why does the number matter? If you like the house And you can afford it. Okay. The numbers come a little bit into that. But forget about the number itself. If the answer is yes, you can afford it, why not have the house?

Michelle [00:25:49]:

I think it was also, you know, looking and saying, can that price me the house I want. So when I had the conversation with my colleague, he went, okay, Kelly. How many bedrooms do you want? I said, well, We could have 3. I said, but I would like 4 because I'd like an office. Okay. So what do you want outside? Do you want it on the road, or do you want somewhere the cars. And I've got 2 daughters who are now both going to be on the road. So we have 4 cars.

Michelle [00:26:13]:

We're not liked. And Okay. I'd like somewhere to put the cars. Okay. You know, would you like a garage? Well, I don't really care about a garage, but my husband probably would. Right. Okay. So when he sort of did that, and then he said, right.

Michelle [00:26:25]:

So all those things, you know so, yes, I do live on the South Coast, so Julie probably have heart failure in a minute. You kind of put down onto prices of houses, and he went, well, you're looking at 5 to 600,000. And I'm Julie, what I would

Julie [00:26:39]:

have thought Money, actually.

Michelle [00:26:40]:

You know? And that's not necessarily that that that's what I'm going to buy. It was just he said you need to think about what you want. If you could get the house you want in the price range you're looking at, fine. But if you're compromising and going for what you think you, you know, deserve, then you're wrong. And he made me print out pictures from Rightmove.

Julie [00:27:09]:

We need an extra bedroom

Michelle [00:27:10]:

me the house I want.

Julie [00:27:12]:

We need an extra bedroom for when, you know, the co-host of the women in Money cafe come to visit. Don't worry. So Exactly. Just putting in a request here. Right.

Michelle [00:27:23]:

Absolutely fine.

Emily [00:27:24]:

And we need

Michelle [00:27:25]:

to be

Emily [00:27:25]:

able to park our cars as well so could just get a really long gravel drive. I think

Sara [00:27:32]:

they're going to do.

Julie [00:27:34]:

I'm going to hazard a guess that there are plenty of people listening to this podcast who Women they're either aware that they think this or when they go away on reflect on things, They're going to find a similar story playing in their head. So I'm just curious, Michelle. What would you what's the one thing you would want them to take away from the podcast?

Michelle [00:27:55]:

But nothing is set in stone. The beliefs you have are just your beliefs for your reasons. They're your internal Mechanism as to what you believe. And just to show you how different something can be In the same household, my daughter has just booked her 1st holiday abroad with her friend. Amazing. I remember my holiday abroad with my friend and what that was like and where we stayed. So I'm pleased my children obviously haven't taken on my belief she came downstairs and said, I booked my 1st holiday. Mom, I'm going 11 days all inclusive in a 4 to 5 star hotel in Corfu.

Michelle [00:28:37]:

Amazing. And I'm just like, your 1st holiday. I mean, my friend actually went there last year, and she's in her fifties. You know? And she said, okay. So that's 2 19 year olds on their 1st holiday. But clearly, that's what Her she said, mom, you've always told me not to compromise for something if I don't want it. So I clearly had an effect on my children, And whether that's a positive or negative, we'll wait to see. But, you know, I tried hard not to pass on my beliefs to my children, and hopefully that's one way of demonstrating that I clearly didn't.

Michelle [00:29:15]:

I think you've done a

Julie [00:29:16]:

you've done a stand up job there of making sure that your kids Do not inherit that belief, Michelle. Well done.

Michelle [00:29:21]:

Can I ask you, Michelle?

Emily [00:29:22]:

Is that when she asked how much money was left in the little pot you've got for her?

Michelle [00:29:26]:

Nope. She has paid for that all herself out of her wages.

Sara [00:29:30]:

Brilliant.

Michelle [00:29:31]:

Wow. With her little pot. She's got both. 2.

Julie [00:29:35]:

She's got both. Alright. Look. Thank you very much for sharing that because I think everybody's been really honest there and shared their deepest, darkest secrets there, haven't they? What and

Michelle [00:29:44]:

and how about your secrets? Yeah. I was just about to

Julie [00:29:47]:

wrap up the show there.

Sara [00:29:49]:

No. No.

Michelle [00:29:50]:

No. No.

Julie [00:29:50]:

No. No. Alright. Okay. So the thing that I used to believe about money that I no longer believe, I used to believe that money wasn't important, which is ironic given what I do for a living. Well, I was of the belief that money is just a thing. Main actually sounds, like, really sensible on the surface until you dig Deeper. So, like, Money just a tool.

Julie [00:30:16]:

It's just us things. The things that really matter in life are relationships and people and experiences Is what the story I told myself. But when I started digging deeper with it, it's not so much that money wasn't important. It's a bit more like you, Michelle. I didn't think I was important, so I didn't really need money. Don't know why where that one came from. And I don't think we want to dig into that too much either. So it's a bit sim similar to you, Michelle.

Julie [00:30:45]:

It's just like, I didn't think I deserved money or I wasn't important.

Michelle [00:30:50]:

But what made you change?

Julie [00:30:53]:

A bloody course As we call it.

Michelle [00:30:55]:

Yeah. I have to agree with you there. It has a lot to answer for.

Julie [00:31:00]:

It's like it was Nila. Nila is another one of our financial adviser friends. She was doing a little breakout session with me on, what was it, the money habitudes Questionnaire.

Emily [00:31:11]:

Mhmm.

Julie [00:31:12]:

And that's when the penny dropped that I've been telling myself this this bullshit story, that money isn't important because it was cover for I'm not important. And I've and, like, throughout the years, I've found all these creative ways to get rid of money. If I accidentally made too much money, I would find really clever. And it looked, like, super nice the way I got rid of money because it would be to charity. It would be, you know, it would be all good things. I wasn't reckless with it. But then, uh-huh, then the penny dropped. And it's I think a lot of it's actually tied in Michelle worth as well.

Emily [00:31:43]:

Mhmm. Yep.

Julie [00:31:45]:

And so, like, I've made a concerted effort to build Michelle. Like, my ego's the size of our planet now, by the way. But no. That that valuing yourself and realizing that you can do things just for you. So, Yeah. A bit like you, Michelle, it's really uncomfortable at the start.

Michelle [00:32:02]:

Yeah. No. I'm getting

Julie [00:32:03]:

I'm getting much better with it now.

Michelle [00:32:06]:

That that that course, I think, You know, we made we went through the journey that we would do with a client. And I and I think that's really nice if you do see a financial coach at some point, you understand that they've probably been through that journey when they've done the training to coach you. And it is and I know I think pretty much all of us had a light bulb moment at some point whilst doing that training, whether it be positive or negative. But yeah, it has sort of helped to change our beliefs. Doesn't it really? So it's obviously had the positive effect.

Julie [00:32:41]:

It has. Because now I have a lot more self worth. I have boundaries, which I really wish I'd figured out earlier on in life, but I'm getting good at them as well. And it's that ability to be able to do nice things for yourself. Could do nice things for other Poole, but I can do them for now as well. I got a cracking tip off of actually, it was a it was a client. So it was financial coaching client who had similar issues to Michelle, And they came up with this brilliant solution for themselves on how because you give you ask questions. So what steps are you going to take Change us.

Julie [00:33:14]:

And they invented a Trello board of ascending treats, of getting used to being able Spend money on themselves, and they started small. And then once they felt comfortable with that, they would spend a little bit more money on themselves and then a little bit more and then a little bit more. And they just had this whole system. I thought, that's absolutely brilliant. I'm stealing that. So confidentiality, I can't share who the client was. But that person, thank you very much for your Trello board. Alright.

Julie [00:33:45]:

Now is any further questions for me? I'm now allowed to wrap up The show.

Emily [00:33:51]:

I was just going to say Money thing which might be appropriate given that we our listeners are women, and it's January, and maybe some of us want health kicks. But this whole sort of self worth thing, I've also heard that, linked to why women can find it difficult to lose weight. In that so a bit of a tangent, but just as a little parallel to finish the show. Juliet's frowning at me.

Michelle [00:34:22]:

But A

Julie [00:34:23]:

lot I'm a bit nervous Women you're going with it, Siamese. Oh, let

Emily [00:34:27]:

me go with it. So a lot of people hold on to their weight In the same way that a lot of women don't get good with money and don't get Just feeling that they're deserving of money. A lot of women will think they're not deserving of having that amazing body. I have heard that as a parallel. It's the comfort thing. It's putting a barrier between you and the real world.

Sara [00:34:59]:

My barrier is quite large, isn't it? Just go up and down.

Julie [00:35:05]:

I'm So glad I wasn't taking a sip of water there.

Michelle [00:35:13]:

Do you

Julie [00:35:14]:

know what?

Michelle [00:35:14]:

It's that time

Julie [00:35:15]:

of year where all of us where we got a slightly bigger barrier between us and the world. But the Money thing you can rely on the women and money captain for is to break down whatever barriers we find out there in the world. We show no respect whatsoever. So I think you just kind of surprised me there, Emily. I think this might be one for us to Exploring future episodes because it's not something not something I'd considered before. Okay.

Sara [00:35:42]:

It's the same it's

Emily [00:35:44]:

the same self worth Yeah.

Sara [00:35:46]:

Belief. And it doesn't matter whether you want, you know, what your body or things to your image to be or to look like, But it's that safe, and it's and it's going back to when we we've talked before about how you feel about money when you do understand it and you do manage it well. Well, It's understanding that you could feel like that about yourself physically, mentally, and emotionally as well.

Emily [00:36:07]:

I think everyone's got that barrier, whether it's, You know, the muffin top the empty blanket. The you know, someone's easing something somewhere. Yeah.

Julie [00:36:19]:

Okay. Well, thank you for the interesting tangent, Emily. I'll look forward to revisiting your tangent. But now really, really, Everybody, thank you very much, Sara, Michelle, Emily, for sharing those insights with us. Thank you, listeners, for listening to us, and until next time. Please do take care of yourselves.